This: Let’s face it—the cosmological question is right at the edge of our conceptual thresholds. Try imagining “nothing.” Try imagining a time before existence. But then, try imagining that existence has always existed. What is more mind-blowing—infinity or the possibility of something other than infinity?
I was raised evangelical. I rebelled. I tried valiantly to be an atheist for years and years. There was always this voice inside me that said "No, you are not!" Then, something happened I cannot explain. Around 50-ish I started reading a lot of origin of life stuff. LSS, I converted to Catholicism. I know a lot of people don't like the Catholics. It was my window in. Do I struggle with my faith. Hell yeah. Alas, I love the struggle. I think the struggle is part of what makes it so meaningful.
atheists like to point to causal relationships and consequences all the way up to the Big Bang when the Universe created everything out of nothing. as Terrance McKenna points out “the one miracle science will allow, is the greatest miracle of all”.
at some point in my life I had to admit that believing an entire Universe sprang from nothing spontaneously was actually was far more ignorant than presupposing a creator. the fact that many ‘intellectuals’ were perfectly fine with this absurd explanation said more about them than any argument. in fact, every so called ‘atheist’ I’ve ever met, once I scratched beneath the surface a bit, proved to be more motivated by an irrational hatred of religious dogma than an objective observer carefully weighing rational arguments.
having said that, the concept of Eternity might always be somewhat of a paradox for us humans to ultimately comprehend...
"...either God is divine or, in some sense, the Universe is." Excellent.
For me, it was in my college biology class when I learned the details of what was necessary for the simplest form of life, a prokaryotic cell, to function. I determined that there absolutely must be a designer/creator.
Sometimes I think about the fact that I can make many things, but I cannot make a simple flower. Something in me appreciates the flower, even though I cannot make one. Maybe our ability to appreciate beauty, love, have a conscience, or not (free will) implies something important. It is a relief as well to know I did not make the world.
Raised Catholic I think it was organized religion that led me to feel more agnostic until my 40s. As you live, have experiences, and definitely when you have children you see intelligent design EVERYWHERE. I see God and Universe as one in the same now. One cannot be living through these perilous times and think "this is it". This is most definitely not it for us, well most of us. You can feel it in your soul that this is temporary and not the end. It is the real-time battle of light vs dark that I struggle with right now. As I tell my sons, Be The Light and recognize the dark so you can avoid it.
I stick to a Buddhist view that it's a constant change and there is no beginning or there will be no end.
Gods come and go but the change is forever.
I was in a changing room getting ready for a BJJ class. There was a guy, a young guy. I started a conversation to avoid an awkward silence and asked him what he does in life. he told me that he studies astrophysics at Cambridge.
I asked him whether he started to believe in god yet. He answered, " I started my master's degree and now I started to believe in god".
I guess, when deeper one goes then they start to see that the atheist view has no legs to stand on.
Thank you. Maybe religions can be viewed as different Forms of Appreciation.
Imagine how that might change the way we conceptualize difference.
The Chronicles of Narnia and others by C.S. Lewis are important books, imho, and were magical in the best of ways to me as a kid. Sensory experience is also its own metaphysical realm. I think even Aldous Huxley eventually jumped ship ~ which says a lot. Thank you for the beautiful and fascinating thread and for your post.
To think that existence is only present when you are living your life reveals how egotistical human beings are. Did God just make the Universe for the human race? In my view, of course not. To accept that humanity is only one small part of the Cosmos requires humility. And humility strips away the egocentricity that prevents people from seeing truths about themselves and others.
This is how I’ve often been made to feel by many who believe in the superiority of atheism. If you don’t want to be belittled you have to pretend to not believe in God, something I couldn’t do… I just took the punches.
Just yesterday someone made a big announcement to block me because of my “spiritual new age drivel”
I'm fine coexisting with whatever beliefs people want to take on, as long as their God doesn't whisper in their ear that they should make war on their neighbors, as so often seems to happen, oddly enough. Right now, Israel is casting the Palestinians as Amalek, and apparently God commands them to smite all of them, man, woman, child, and I think even farm animals.
For the spiritual side of life, my experience is that no belief in an invisible sky creature is necessary to make a connection. Joseph Campbell's views ("The Power of Myth", etc.) coincide nicely with mine. But, whatever floats each individual's boat is fine with me.
Bold move Christopher. I like how you think. Most of us ponder our existence. I didn’t notice it at the time, but now that I’m older I realize that I’ve run off instinct my entire life. Earlier in the thread a writer posits that we (living things) are integrated antennas. I believe he’s correct. If you follow the theory of the Yugas, we’ve been at a low point in our connection to source for several thousand years now. As we’re coming out of this low many will start to reconnect and we won’t be able to be so easily deceived. Viola, the Great Awakening.
As to the great religions, like politics, they often seem different but lead to the same places. The greatest lies are often hidden amongst the greatest truths becoming nothing more than control systems. We live in a labyrinth of control systems, as you well know. I enjoy reading the black and white academic debate amongst philosophers, but to know the unknowable you just have to go with your gut. So like Jacqueline, I’m just gonna live in color until the signal gets strong enough for me to understand why.
Acknowledgment is nice, but you don’t have to engage every nuance. You’re working your ass off Christopher.
Great article. I was raised as an atheist. My family is very secular. It’s the evil that’s been going on in the world, depression and sin are the reasons for me to find God and to know Christ.
All of which begs the question..if God exists/is the universe, what sort of God/universe is it? A good one or a bad one?
I had been an atheist ever since I (sort of) came out the other side of a religious upbringing some 30 years ago. Then one day I had a sudden realization. What if the reason that things are so incredibly bad here for most people on the planet is *because* the Judeo-Christian God is actually running things? I mean, I've read the Old Testament in its entirety.
Now instead of being afraid that there is no God, I'm terrified that there is.
I never understood atheism. Something about the beliefs seemed arrogant to me. Likewise, I couldn't understand Christianity, as there was something self-centered about believing God was watching us 24/7. I was agnostic for a long time as a kid. But the more I learned about the world--and the more I still learn now--the more divine the Universe becomes.
My God is the Cosmos, and it's nice having a life dedicated to it, even if it never notices you in the way people expect.
This: Let’s face it—the cosmological question is right at the edge of our conceptual thresholds. Try imagining “nothing.” Try imagining a time before existence. But then, try imagining that existence has always existed. What is more mind-blowing—infinity or the possibility of something other than infinity?
I was raised evangelical. I rebelled. I tried valiantly to be an atheist for years and years. There was always this voice inside me that said "No, you are not!" Then, something happened I cannot explain. Around 50-ish I started reading a lot of origin of life stuff. LSS, I converted to Catholicism. I know a lot of people don't like the Catholics. It was my window in. Do I struggle with my faith. Hell yeah. Alas, I love the struggle. I think the struggle is part of what makes it so meaningful.
great story!
atheists like to point to causal relationships and consequences all the way up to the Big Bang when the Universe created everything out of nothing. as Terrance McKenna points out “the one miracle science will allow, is the greatest miracle of all”.
at some point in my life I had to admit that believing an entire Universe sprang from nothing spontaneously was actually was far more ignorant than presupposing a creator. the fact that many ‘intellectuals’ were perfectly fine with this absurd explanation said more about them than any argument. in fact, every so called ‘atheist’ I’ve ever met, once I scratched beneath the surface a bit, proved to be more motivated by an irrational hatred of religious dogma than an objective observer carefully weighing rational arguments.
having said that, the concept of Eternity might always be somewhat of a paradox for us humans to ultimately comprehend...
"...either God is divine or, in some sense, the Universe is." Excellent.
For me, it was in my college biology class when I learned the details of what was necessary for the simplest form of life, a prokaryotic cell, to function. I determined that there absolutely must be a designer/creator.
Sometimes I think about the fact that I can make many things, but I cannot make a simple flower. Something in me appreciates the flower, even though I cannot make one. Maybe our ability to appreciate beauty, love, have a conscience, or not (free will) implies something important. It is a relief as well to know I did not make the world.
Raised Catholic I think it was organized religion that led me to feel more agnostic until my 40s. As you live, have experiences, and definitely when you have children you see intelligent design EVERYWHERE. I see God and Universe as one in the same now. One cannot be living through these perilous times and think "this is it". This is most definitely not it for us, well most of us. You can feel it in your soul that this is temporary and not the end. It is the real-time battle of light vs dark that I struggle with right now. As I tell my sons, Be The Light and recognize the dark so you can avoid it.
I stick to a Buddhist view that it's a constant change and there is no beginning or there will be no end.
Gods come and go but the change is forever.
I was in a changing room getting ready for a BJJ class. There was a guy, a young guy. I started a conversation to avoid an awkward silence and asked him what he does in life. he told me that he studies astrophysics at Cambridge.
I asked him whether he started to believe in god yet. He answered, " I started my master's degree and now I started to believe in god".
I guess, when deeper one goes then they start to see that the atheist view has no legs to stand on.
Thank you. Maybe religions can be viewed as different Forms of Appreciation.
Imagine how that might change the way we conceptualize difference.
The Chronicles of Narnia and others by C.S. Lewis are important books, imho, and were magical in the best of ways to me as a kid. Sensory experience is also its own metaphysical realm. I think even Aldous Huxley eventually jumped ship ~ which says a lot. Thank you for the beautiful and fascinating thread and for your post.
To think that existence is only present when you are living your life reveals how egotistical human beings are. Did God just make the Universe for the human race? In my view, of course not. To accept that humanity is only one small part of the Cosmos requires humility. And humility strips away the egocentricity that prevents people from seeing truths about themselves and others.
This is how I’ve often been made to feel by many who believe in the superiority of atheism. If you don’t want to be belittled you have to pretend to not believe in God, something I couldn’t do… I just took the punches.
Just yesterday someone made a big announcement to block me because of my “spiritual new age drivel”
I'm fine coexisting with whatever beliefs people want to take on, as long as their God doesn't whisper in their ear that they should make war on their neighbors, as so often seems to happen, oddly enough. Right now, Israel is casting the Palestinians as Amalek, and apparently God commands them to smite all of them, man, woman, child, and I think even farm animals.
For the spiritual side of life, my experience is that no belief in an invisible sky creature is necessary to make a connection. Joseph Campbell's views ("The Power of Myth", etc.) coincide nicely with mine. But, whatever floats each individual's boat is fine with me.
Bold move Christopher. I like how you think. Most of us ponder our existence. I didn’t notice it at the time, but now that I’m older I realize that I’ve run off instinct my entire life. Earlier in the thread a writer posits that we (living things) are integrated antennas. I believe he’s correct. If you follow the theory of the Yugas, we’ve been at a low point in our connection to source for several thousand years now. As we’re coming out of this low many will start to reconnect and we won’t be able to be so easily deceived. Viola, the Great Awakening.
As to the great religions, like politics, they often seem different but lead to the same places. The greatest lies are often hidden amongst the greatest truths becoming nothing more than control systems. We live in a labyrinth of control systems, as you well know. I enjoy reading the black and white academic debate amongst philosophers, but to know the unknowable you just have to go with your gut. So like Jacqueline, I’m just gonna live in color until the signal gets strong enough for me to understand why.
Acknowledgment is nice, but you don’t have to engage every nuance. You’re working your ass off Christopher.
Well here I am a hitch-hiker. Thank you for the ride.
I was raised Christian but then departed from that. Anselm’s ontological argument played a role in that. Basically,
God is perfect
That which is perfect exists
Therefore God exists
I actually took this to mean not that it established the existence of God but the logical necessity of believing in God.
Of course there’s more to it. But thanks for sharing your story and yay for logic!
Great article. I was raised as an atheist. My family is very secular. It’s the evil that’s been going on in the world, depression and sin are the reasons for me to find God and to know Christ.
All of which begs the question..if God exists/is the universe, what sort of God/universe is it? A good one or a bad one?
I had been an atheist ever since I (sort of) came out the other side of a religious upbringing some 30 years ago. Then one day I had a sudden realization. What if the reason that things are so incredibly bad here for most people on the planet is *because* the Judeo-Christian God is actually running things? I mean, I've read the Old Testament in its entirety.
Now instead of being afraid that there is no God, I'm terrified that there is.
I never understood atheism. Something about the beliefs seemed arrogant to me. Likewise, I couldn't understand Christianity, as there was something self-centered about believing God was watching us 24/7. I was agnostic for a long time as a kid. But the more I learned about the world--and the more I still learn now--the more divine the Universe becomes.
My God is the Cosmos, and it's nice having a life dedicated to it, even if it never notices you in the way people expect.